10 thoughts on “No2ID Petition

  1. While I do respect the right of anybody to protest against changes like that, it still strikes me a bit funny. Or is that because I might jealous that the UK can still prevent that. Almost every country in the world has laws that require civilians to carry papers, and those people are used to it. My wife comes from Colombia, where you could be shot on the spot if you didn’t have them (you could be guerrilla or sicario.)

    Personally I will still defend ID cards, because a person that refuses to show a card to an policeman migth also be threathening to the general population. Not that I accuse everybody to be that dangerous, but why shouldn’t we help the police to quickly sort out if there’s an arrest-warant for you, or if you still has to pay some traffic-tickets, or that your drivers license has been revoked ? You do not have the right to hide your identity, or to use a fake one.

    On the other hand, you also have some more worrying developments. Right at this moment, I’m carrying 3 pieces of id on me :

    – a Belgian identity card, of the newest type : it’s actually a smartcard, which is readable with a suitable cardreader. We’ve tried to read it at my company, it’s not too difficult (it’s the same as what’s visible in printing on the card). The software is even open source.

    – a Belgian passport, against of the newest type, with a built-in RFID chip (with thanks to our American overlords). Again, it’s supposed to contain the same data. Europe and the USA hasn’t decided yet what type of biometric data should be stored later this year on it : probably fingerprints or a digital photo. I’ve seen the technical specs, although I don’t know yet if anyone can just access it.

    – an magnetic access card of my company (it only contains a serial number), which can open the door from 2 feet away.

    And it can get worse. People in my company are experimenting with vending machines where you can pay with your mobile phone, or that might even recognize you from 10 metres away (Bluetooth ofcourse). That’s what they call progress. For me, that’s over the top.

  2. I live in Canada and I only carry ID about 1/2 the time and only cause I need my wallet and it happens to be there. I actually only need my ID very rarely. I would hate to have some sort of universal ID and I don’t think it would really do any good. Social Enginnering will get you furthur than any ID will, I think that’s were the effort should go.

  3. In the Netherlands, since the beginning of this year people are required to carry an ID (from the age of 14) as well. Not having it with you when a police officer asks for it (which he will e.g. do when you�re cycling without lights, or making a lot of noise on the street when you�re drunk, or a witness to a crime scene, etc) will cost you a fine of I believe �50.

    There were a lot of protests, especially because it was for such a young age (IDs aren�t free and young people are kind of prone to losing them, causing an additional cost post for the parents). For me, it doesn�t really matter, I already had my ID card with me at all times because sometimes I pay with my credit card, which often requires identification (the Dutch ID card is nowadays comfortably small, like a bank card). Additionally, I also have a driver�s license since about 1.5 years, which I also always carry with me.

    ~Grauw

  4. The fact that everyone is required to carry an ID made e.g. shopkeepers less hesitant to ask young people who want to buy cigarettes for identification. I guess that�s a good thing.

    Anyways, I don�t really mind. My mother thinks it�s rediculous though.

    ~Grauw

  5. Truth is we have gotten by without an id card since 194?, it went out after the war and we have managed pretty well, its not so much the id card itself
    in the uk we already have a medical card and a national insurance no. so we currently have papers as it where its that this id card goes to far and also costs eighty F-ing pounds, its the national data-base and the bio-metric data that make this card so potently repressive. The list of who is can insist on the deatails is also very large and potentialy very dangerous to our privacy
    our freedom to be differant, england has been a very Libral socity for a long time this ID bill goes against of national freedoms which where very great and are rapidly being eroded..this is why Im against the ID bill.

  6. No2ID campaign?
    You are so right in supporting the campaign, it would be ridiculous if they want to oblige you to carry 2 ID cards.

  7. The first thing we need to remember is that the UK is not like other countries. I’m sorry, but we are not. Colombia for example is a country in constant revolution. Where’s the fire here? That’s the point. The UK, USA, Canada, Australia and New Zealand (yes – the anglosphere) and Switserland are the only countries that have not been invaded, torn apart or suffered from revoltionary fire for several hundred years.

    The we have to consider that we don’t have a written constitution – just respect for what has gone before. This means that a government without respect -eg. the smiler’s government can do anything and will do anything.

    If they decide that u are an at risk group, for whatever reason they will be able to knock on your door and licquidate you, just like that.

    They will also, this focus group government, be able to see who they have to keep on side to win elections and who they can screw over, and they are pleased to screw over their enemies (fox hunters for ill or good).

    Then there is the crime, yes crime, of not being on the database. Many radical christian believe that the bible, revelation 14 I think would point this as the “mark of the beast”. These people will be forced into a demi-world of hidden, criminal transactions. Then they will be fined for not being on the register and then sent to prison.

    Then there will be the back room doctors, operations, abortions for those not on the register.

    Then there will be the cost, running to billions payable by you

    Then there will be the mistakes, the mistaken identity that means u are sent to prison for a crime u did not commit.

    The there is the fact that this will not even affect terrorists who will be able to register in Europe and come over, or register normally until they want to do something wrong.

    This is a thought control system. It is dangerous, it is fascist.

    We are at liberty to not give our details to policemen, because the system in the UK is that we are free, Anywhere else in the world the system is that you have the freedoms of the constitution. Only if the police suspect you of a crime do they have the right to stop you. Then if you really do resemble a suspect they are looking for then and there they can detain you. They do not have the right to stop you and check your id and see if they can find a reason to screw you over, This is discriminatory. And with all the new crimes that are not enforced, frankly, we can be fined for Climate Crimes by farting.

  8. Chas, you made many good points in the previous comment but I am not sure why you brought up “radical christians”. Do you know someone that is reacting in this way to the national ID register? I’m not sure you do.

    To clarify from my own experience which has encountered most perpectives within Christianity at some point (as the whole biblical prophecy thing has a tendency to come up occassionally when these subjects are discussed) there are a *minority* of Christians in the UK who believe that in Revelations (Ch 13 v 17) is a prophecy that predicts a coming corrupt world government who will seek to control the population through technology (and violence). Many people who believe this *may* oppose the national ID register on the basis that is is A STEP towards this kind of abuse but not that the existence of a national database IS the fulfillment of the prophecy itself. Many non-religious people also oppose the national ID register because they see the possibility of abuse occurring based on natural deduction.

    So I don’t think it is really an issue in this context and wouldn’t worry about it.

    I take your point, though, that people who disagree with the national register on an ideological basis will end up being criminalised.

    (Before anyone feels the need to say it, we already know you “think anyone who believes in Revelation and prophecy is nuts” :-P ).

  9. Although I am not a Christian and do not believe in prophecy, I nevertheless think the bit about a corrupt world government has some truth in it as the activites of the Bilderberger Group and the Rockefeller Institute are certainly sinister.

    The EU is merely a step along the way and ID cards are being forced upon us like Regional Government and so many other awful ideas at the behest of the EU.

    Jean Bowler

  10. Firstly may I say that I am an athiest who has an extensive understanding of Christianity.

    The issue of the words in the Book of Revelation, Ch13 V17, regarding “the number of his name” and the necessity of this number being needed to buy or sell – i.e. to freely move around and economically function in UK society – could in my view certainly be construed by Christians as reasonable justification for refusing to comply with ID card legislation. This would hopefully bring them within legislation against religious and racial discrimination and therefore nicely wreck the ID card scheme.

    I urge all Christians to refuse to comply with the ID card scheme. I will do so in any case. I shall refuse to give my fingerprints and any other biometric data and will not pay for the card.