34 thoughts on “Firefox Bug Causes Breakup

  1. This is one of those posts which don’t really help anybody and might just get emotions stirred up.

    As it sounds, she would’ve preferred not to know – so instead of showing some mischievous aspect of christianhood, you’d better feel compassionately sorry for her. And instead of just pointing to the misfortune, you could also point to where it should be taken care of that such misfortune won’t be repeated: bug 234680.

  2. Simon: I don’t agree with your characterisation at all. My posting is a commentary on the boyfriend’s sliminess, and how such deception can never pay off in the long run, not an attack on her in any way. How can it be “mischevious” to point out a Biblical truth?

    In some circumstances, it might be tactless – but as far as I can see, she seems to be pretty sanguine about it. Certainly, if I were her, I’d be relieved that I wasn’t already married to the guy – and see it as fortunate, not as a misfortune.

  3. I’m confused about how this is a Firefox bug. For modern systems, I am not aware of a single major application, commercial or otherwise, open-source or otherwise, that removes personal data such as profiles from user accounts on uninstall.

    DOS apps used to do that, of course, because there were no user accounts on DOS, and the user’s settings were stored in the application’s own install directory. The same goes for Win16 applications. But on all *current* systems of which I am aware, certainly including WinXP, the uninstallation is expected to be performed from the admin account, not from the normal user account.

    I think the real issue here is that the multi-user paradigm has not really arrived in most end users’ thinking, so that home users still do not make in their thinking the distinction between user data and system data. This may be partly because of the large number of OEMs that only set up an Administrator account and leave the users to set up their own user accounts, without providing any instruction on the importance of doing so, which leaves a lot of users running as Administrator all the time, oblivious to the issues.

    I’d lay this one at the feet of the OEM that built the computer, probably, for setting up the system in a way that allowed the user to run install/uninstall without logging into a separate, administrative account to do so, leaving the user thinking of the system as a single-user system.

    If a user deliberatly _chooses_ to run as Admin all the time, so be it (I, knowing the issues, choose run as root all the time at home), but the system should *come* with a regular (“limited” in NT parlance) user account set up to auto-login, and Administrator account passwords printed on little cards (probably three of them: one attached to the install/restore CD, one in a small envelope attached to the side of the computer case, and one affixed to the *inside* of the computer case, for tech support people to use when home users throw away or lose the other two with the discs and documentation).

  4. Very nice post if you ask me. From time to time me and a friend have indroductary Mozilla Firefox at NTNU (the university of Trondheim, Norway). This will be another fine example on what not to do or what to do/check, lol. The other being:


    oh, sure, yeah, i can install another and better browser on your machine. It’ll only take a minute. Then suddenly; do you use bookmarks? Do you want me to import your IE bookmarks? Eh, yeah, sure why not!?

    Done, in maybe even less than a minute. Showing lots of pron links open in the bookmarks toolbar.

    My god. NEver import bookmarks for people, it only gets very very awkward. If they want bookmarks they’ll have to import them when they are alone……lol.

  5. Jonadab-
    I’ve come across certain applications where it’s unfeasable to use in anything but admin mode. Winamp is a program that comes to my mind. Sure, I could always use “run as admin” when I use it, but it interferes with Foxytunes by not showing the song title. Through trial and error, I found that it was Winamp at fault, and not Foxytunes. That’s just one reason why I bite the bullet and choose to use admin mode.

    This bug just seems to be invalid, after some testing.

  6. Gerv: You’re quite quick in judging her boyfriend – without hardly knowing even her side of the story. And while your intentions for this post might have been proper, I still maintain that to non-christians your “biblical truth” might not appear as neutral as it does to you (I’d read it as a “caught ya!”). A quotation – even of biblical origin – can get quite a different meaning depending on the context it’s uttered. Although I must admit that on repeated lecture, it doesn’t sound as harsh anymore.

  7. How can it be “mischevious” to point out a Biblical truth?

    It’s unlikely the bug reporter was asking for sanctimonious-seeming quotations. I certainly didn’t ask for them when I subscribed to Planet Mozilla. <rolls eyes>

    Besides, did you notice that one of the sites in question was JDate.com? The bug reporter’s boyfriend is almost certainly Jewish, and it’s fairly likely the bug reporter is also. In which case, it’s not exactly Biblical to them, is it?

  8. agum: Then how about Proverbs 5:15 and following?

    Drink water from your own cistern,
    running water from your own well.

    Should your springs overflow in the streets,
    your streams of water in the public squares?

    Let them be yours alone,
    never to be shared with strangers.

    May your fountain be blessed,
    and may you rejoice in the wife of your youth.

    A loving doe, a graceful deer�
    may her breasts satisfy you always,
    may you ever be captivated by her love.

    Why be captivated, my son, by an adulteress?
    Why embrace the bosom of another man’s wife?

    For a man’s ways are in full view of the LORD,
    and he examines all his paths.

  9. Firefox Bug #330884: “This privacy flaw has caused my fiancé and I to break-up after having dated for 5 years”

    A Firefox user claims that a privacy leak in the application has caused her and her fiancé to break up, and submitted the incident via Bugzilla to the Firefox team:
    “The privacy flaw is this: when he went to log-in under his dating sites (jdate.com, swin

  10. Deuteronomy

    20 If, however, the charge is true and no proof of
    the girl's virginity can be found,
    21 she shall be brought to the door of her father's house and there
    the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful
    thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father's house.
    You must purge the evil from among you.

    So, perhaps he was trying to learn how to tell if the girlfriend was to be stoned or not?

  11. Simon, I may have read things wrong, but I don’t think Gerv was doing any judging. He (and the rest of us) don’t have any business judging her boyfriend. That’s up to God alone.

  12. How can it be “mischevious” to point out a Biblical truth?

    “And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.” (Matt. 27:5)

    “Go, and do thou likewise.” (Luke 11:37)

    In other news: if you love someone, you don’t mock them, or gloat about their misfortune. I know you’re going to say you weren’t doing either, but that’s what it looks like…

  13. James M: If you feel either of the quotations I used were taken out of context and not relevant to the situation, please tell me how this is the case. Otherwise, your analogy doesn’t hold.

    Why does it look like I’m mocking or gloating? What part of my post has that tone?

  14. : Why does it look like I’m mocking or gloating?

    All of it, the whole thing. Why draw attention to this “bug” if it’s not in some way amusing? Or is this just your way of illustrating “biblical truth”?

    Either you’re mocking or you’re implying this is God’s judgement on these people (“it just happens to some people sooner than others”). Either one seems odious to me — we shouldn’t be doing either.

  15. Why draw attention to this “bug” if it’s not in some way amusing?

    Perhaps because my blog does not consist solely of the “amusing”?

    Either you’re mocking or you’re implying this is God’s judgement on these people (“it just happens to some people sooner than others”).

    Luke 12:2-4 is in the context of God’s judgement – so eventually, at the last day, everything that is done in secret will be made known. In this case, it’s happened earlier than that – hence my comment to that effect. This incident, combined with Jesus’s words, is a reminder to other people that they should not expect their evil deeds to remain a secret for ever.

  16. Gerv, I’ve never heard such a sanctimonious load of utter BS. You’re no better qualified to say what is and is not God’s judgement than I am. What a load of smug, condescending rubbish.

  17. James M: you seem to be looking for any excuse to be condemnatory. I was very careful in my last response specifically to not say whether I think this particular incident was an example of God’s judgement. As you say, I have no way of determining that. But, like the tower of Siloam in Luke 13, the events are a (in this case, fairly small) warning to everyone else that judgement is coming.

  18. : I was very careful in my last response specifically to not say whether I think this particular incident was an example of God’s judgement.

    But that’s clearly what you think because “the events are a … warning to everyone else that judgement is coming.” It’s appalling that you think like that about someone else’s misfortune.

    : you seem to be looking for any excuse to be condemnatory.

    No, I’m just finding it odd that you post like this. If you’re a Christian, it isn’t right to mock or judge others for their misfortunes. You say you’re not doing either, but holding others up for scrutiny like this invites others to do so even if you’re not. And, of course, you’ll say that’s not your intention either, but it *is* the effect.

    Side point: Why does your original post look like mockery? Because you imply that a software bug is part of God’s judgement, as if he’d rather tinker with your file permissions than rain down fire and brimstone.

  19. James M said: But that’s clearly what you think because “the events are a … warning to everyone else that judgement is coming.”

    That doesn’t follow. Did you read the Luke 13 passage? I’ll quote it in full:

    Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. Jesus answered, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them – do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish.”

    So, to transfer the principle to this situation:

    Do you think that the boyfriend is a worse sinner than other men because his unfaithfulness was revealed and the couple split up? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all have your secrets revealed.

    The fact that it happened to this couple (or those Galileans, or those eighteen) is not a commentary on or judgement of the depth of their sin, it’s a warning to you, James M, and to me, Gerv, that we need to get into a right relationship with God.

    How many more ways do I have to say it? My original post, my point then and now, and the bits of the Bible I am quoting are all pointing in the same direction, and it’s not the direction you continue to accuse me of pointing in. I’m not sure how I can make myself clearer.

  20. : I’m not sure how I can make myself clearer.

    Don’t worry Gerv, I think I’m getting it. I don’t see messages from God in Windows permission errors but clearly you do.

  21. “there is nothing hidden….”

    well we may as well play confessions then

    i surfed the web half the day in the office yesterday

    anyone else care to join in?

    (yes I’m anonymous coward, you can be anonymous too, I don’t care who you are, just get whatever it is off your chest)

  22. What an interesting discussion.

    I don�t believe that Gerv�s intentions were to act as �judge and jury�. I agree that quoting scripture can illicit emotions particularly from people who do not share that belief. At times it can be perceived as �Judgmental� depending on the context.

    Gerv seems sensitive to the posters (James M) concerns about his attitudes toward the intent of the post it�s self while not compromising Truth.

    (IMOP) this was probably a �blessing in disguise� for the woman and hopefully a wake up call to the man (see: on a side note below).

    It reminded me of a scripture verse that I believe fleshes out the reason why people react to scripture.
    Hebrews 4:12-13 (NIV)
    (12) For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. (13) Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
    On a side note: What this couple has experienced is (in my opinion) the best kept secret in Christianity (at least in the US). Porn is eroding the Church and destroying family�s and lives in its path. Who�s fault is this you ask? It�s our own fault for pretending that it�s not a problem. Go here is you don�t believe me http://www.blazinggrace.org/.

    And yes, I am recovering from this myself.

  23. : the reason why people react to scripture

    I don’t object to scripture: some of it means a great deal to me. But other parts seem quite nonsensical, not helped by the resurgence of 6-day creationism and other foolishness.

    Here’s my football (I mean English soccer) analogy, if you’ll bear with me:

    You get some fans for whom supporting a team is a life-long tradition which has been in the family for generations. They quietly turn up each week, enjoy every twist and subtlety in the game, and don’t mind too much about the winning and losing. They hope one day to see their team win a trophy or two, maybe even go to the cup final themselves, but what they really want to do is connect with other people, regardless of which team they support.

    Others are loud, really loud. They don’t have any liking for the people at the match, or any genuine passion for the game, although they’ve memorised all the statistics. They want above all to win more and more trophies. For them, it’s all about rewards of one kind or another, but they quickly lose interest if their team has a couple of bad seasons.

    Some fans are violent. They don’t care about the game and the people are just targets; they just want a fight. Any excuse for an argument and the ensuing punch-up.

    I didn’t come here to argue with Gerv, it just happened like that. The reason I read his blog is because I tend to respect his viewpoint. But I found out a long time ago, from bruising experience, that the “loud” brand of Christianity helps nobody. The Christians who impress me most of all just quietly get on with it. I’ve met people who I knew at first sight were Christians — it’s inexplicable how you can know that, but it’s true. They didn’t mention their faith until I asked them about it. If there were more people like them, everyone would want to join their church. But there are hardly any, and it’s been a long, long time since I went. That’s one of the best decisions I ever made, btw, and I’m sticking to it. I’d advise anyone who’s feeling stifled by their church and the “truths” presented there to try on a few new ideas and thoughts, get out and mingle with the “sinners”. Liberate yourself. I don’t believe any sane god would hold that against you.

    I’m not trying to rekindle this btw ;-) This is just a viewpoint: you can take it or leave it.

  24. Sad story. Sad bug. But i would prefer to read the fianc�e�s excuses to make a complete point of view.

    Anyway, Gerv is right and the Bible citation is just perfect.

  25. James M: Nice summary (I like the Football analogy).

    Being a Christian (I usually prefer to say I�m a follower of Christ because the word Christian can get you pigeonholed) I am really impressed with your honesty. You are correct, �we Christians� need to live out our faith and serve others��..not cram religiosity down people�s throat. This comment is not directed toward Gerv or this post, it�s more of a general feeling I have. (plus I think Gerve is a cool guy).

    Our actions and behavior should draw other people toward wanting a relationship with Christ. All too often Christians give God a bad name (including me) and get in the way of showing people how freeing it is to be a Christian. We need to get our hands dirty and let people know that that Christians fail and struggle with all the same things everyone else does. We don’t have all the answers, and that’s ok.

    My friends and I have been doing just what you suggested (�try on a few new ideas and thoughts, get out and mingle with the “sinners”) We are taking a new look at our faith and re-examining it. So far what we found is this ��.what worked for our parents does not necessary work for us.

    James, keep questioning everything and don�t stop seeking truth. God is too big to be put in a box. I think you�re on the right track.

    Take care, RAM

  26. : God is too big to be put in a box. I think you�re on the right track.

    RAM, thank you. That’s one of the best things anyone’s said to me for quite a while :)

  27. James M: the trouble with the football (soccer) analogy is that in the end, it doesn’t really matter which team you support. I’m a Liverpool fan, but if I was a Chelsea fan, nothing would really be different.

    It’s all very well being impressed by Christians who quietly get on with being good people, but if you aren’t challenged to get into a right relationship with God yourself, then they are actually doing you a serious disservice. How that message should be put across varies from place to place and time to time – whatever will get people to listen – but not putting it across at all is a dereliction of responsibilities.

    You don’t have to get out of a church to mingle with sinners; they are all around you. A church is a hospital for broken and sinful people. Turning your back on God to “liberate yourself” is approximately equivalent to a fish “liberating itself” from the restricting confines of a water-based existence by leaping out onto the bank. With approximately the same results.

    RAM: re-examining is good; but don’t re-examine “your faith” – re-examine Jesus, and his claims on your life in the 21st century. If your re-examination is rooted there, you’ll get much better results.

  28. : but if you aren’t challenged to get into a right relationship with God yourself

    Gerv, that’s the entire point. They challenged me 1,000 times more than you ever could have, or probably ever will. I’ve said enough. Sorry you feel the need to be right all the time.

  29. James M: What, in your own words, did they challenge you to do? And do you feel you have done it? If not, why didn’t you?

    This is really a genuine question. I’m extremely interested in your answer.

  30. : What, in your own words, did they challenge you to do?

    Stop being a religious bigot and start caring about people. HTH.

  31. Yes, that really helps – because it shows that what you think they challenged you to do, while worthy and important, is not the message of Jesus – which was “Repent, and believe the good news”. If you weren’t challenged to repent, then I again suggest that you were done a disservice.